Power Pros Forum

I'M going to shoot myself in the gut soon after what happened today.

just a rare rough day as a Yankees fan...

Well now you can't have Lackey, the best pitcher in your market(and to add insult to injury he went to the Red Sox)
No more Matsui
No chance at Halladay

But in other news, the Red Sox and Yankees will play Sunday night baseball to begin the regular season..

other good news I have is that because of the raffle thing, I chose a fan pack where I get 4 tickets to a Rangers, Angels, Rays and Yankees game this season. The 4 most rivals of the Red Sox pretty much and the game against the Yankees is an October 1st game so maybe it will be a huge game

Well, anyone seeing a Cards vs. Mariners World Series in 2010?

It would be perfect!!! For me, anyway.

I think this is a great trade for the Mariners and the Jays, but I don't particularly like this deal as a Phillies fan. I don't think the guys we are getting from the Mariners are worth Cliff Lee. They are not top-tier prospects. I think we should have been able to acquire at least 1 top-tier prospect along with the other prospects in return for one year of Lee. Especially since it looks like the Mariners aren't giving anything to the Jays, it would have been much simpler to trade for Halladay and take time to field better offers for Lee.

If I were the GM of the Phillies, I would have traded for Roy Halladay and KEPT Lee, then shop Lee off at the trade deadline. It would have been less complicated and we probably could have gotten the same level prospects. This way, we still get about 2/3 a season of Lee+Halladay pwnage and only have pay about $6M more.

In other news, White Sox acquire Juan Pierre from the Dodgers.

What I say to that is good luck getting Halladay without Lee. The Phills don't have anything close besides Lee to trade for him with.

I'm going to do a little analysis of the Lee and Halladay trades, starting from July 2009:

These are the players that the Phillies gave up:
Lou Marson C to Cleveland
Carlos Carrasco P to Cleveland
Jason Knapp P to Cleveland
Jason Donald INF to Cleveland
Michael Taylor OF (?) to Toronto
Kyle Drabek P (?) to Toronto
Travis D'Arnauld C (?) to Toronto
1 Season of Cliff Lee P to Seattle

And these are the players they acquired:
1/3 Season of Cliff Lee P
Ben Francisco OF
Roy Halladay P
Phillippe Aumont P (?)
Tyson Gillies OF (?)
Juan Ramirez P (?)

So what do you think?

In my opinion, the haul from Seattle is approximately (not quite) equal to the players the Phillies traded to Cleveland. So really, the Phillies traded Taylor, Drabek, and D'Arnauld for Francisco, Halladay, and 1/3 season of Cliff Lee. In the end, it seems like a fairly good trade-off. It might have been about the same, however, if the Phillies had traded for Halladay in July '09. In that case, the only major piece we would have gained would be Francisco, who is certainly a good 4th outfielder. If the Phillies had gotten a better haul for Lee, however, then I think the final result would have been amazing. Or, as I suggested, if the Phillies had kept Lee for another 2/3 of a season, getting a total full season from him, the overall result would also have been spectacular. I think that both of these ideas were fully possible.

In conclusion, I think the end result is good, certainly better than if the Phillies had done nothing. However, it could have been a bit better, had the Phillies handled the Lee-to-the-Mariners part better. But nobody's perfect, and, all in all, I thank Ruben Amaro Jr. for his ingenuity and creativity.

The Phillies did not have to trade Lee. They could have traded Drabek, Taylor, and D'Arnauld to the Jays in return for Halladay and $6M, then ship Lee off to Seattle or whoever SEPARATELY and come out with the same result, just with better prospects.
Or they could have traded Drabek, Taylor, and D'Arnauld to the Jays, watched Halladay and Lee pwn until the deadline, and then traded Lee.
In other words, it did not have to be a three team trade.

Think of it this way. The Phillies acquired 1/3 season of Lee for Jason Knapp, Carlos Carrasco, Lou Marson, and Jason Donald. The Mariners are getting 1 full season of Lee for Aumont, Gillies, and Ramirez. The two groups are essentially comparable, but the Phillies got only 1/3 of a season while the Mariners are getting a full season.

I would have rather just given up Drabek, Marson, Donald and Knapp for Halladay last year and kept Carrasco, Taylor, and D'Arnaud for myself.

And who cares if you didn't get Francisco, Taylor is probably MLB ready anyway as a 4th outfielder.

I'm just going to say that Aumont is one of the most impressive prospects period in the Mariners organization, and Halladay isn't exactly washed up...

Yah well so was Jason Knapp.

And Halladay is definitely not washed up. He's probably the second or third best right-handed pitcher in baseball. (#1 belongs to Tim Lincecum )

I saw the highlights for the Mariners prospect. He played in the WBC. His breaking balls and off speed stuff are really good and his fastball is ok in around the 90mph range. He is not as polished or mature as the Phillies pitcher they gave up. I'm really bad with names. However, I think they Phillies at a real lose here compared to what they could have got during the season trade dateline. Furthermore, they could have got Halladay and keep a few more prospects and they would have probably won the world series, though I would hate to admit it, but still. In other news, Brett Wallace, the main piece of the Matt Holliday deal is going to the Jays for one of the Phillies prospect that were traded to the Jays. I think Matt Holliday was offered 160 mil/8 years. He should accept it as he is on par with Teixeira in terms of offense, better in speed, but way off in defense and his defense is not fantastic too. Plus, he gets to play in St. Louis, however, Mark McGuire would be there.

What would Adroidls Champman will end up with?

The New York Mets signed Ryota Igarashi to a 2year contract worth around $2 million and will be a set up for man K-Rod replacing 32 year old J.J putz who signed with the White Sox. Ryota, (30 years old) has a career record of 44 wins -27losses
a 3.26 ERA and 51 saves. BY THE WAY...HOW FAST DOES THIS GUY THROW? I HERD HE TOPS 98MPH

He sounds really good, but I don't think he throws that fast. Probably tops out at 95mph.

He played in the japanese league and now he'll play in the NL who all happen to hit fastballs very very well. 98mph is nothing if you don't have a secondary. He might have been able to blow people away in japan but MLB is different. Japanese players have been overrated as they have rarely been able to produce much outside of ichiro, nomo and probably saito or okajima.